More Apples in the Basket

Although our blog title Songwriting Apples refers to another site that the original members of this site came from, we have two new members that we will be adding to the bunch.

Please welcome Eric Shouse and Jason Gaylor. Please continue to check their personal pages to find out a bit about them!

Come on in, write a bit, sit back and listen... whatever feels right,
John

Playing Live

After witnessing the Ann Arbor Folk Festival this past weekend (see my review) I'm feeling pretty motivated about not only writing, but playing out. In addition to hosting such great acts as Over the Rhine, Glen Phillips, Bill Staines and more, The Ark in Ann Arbor has an open stage night about once a month. I've played out a bunch as the drummer for my band in years past, but never as a singer/songwriter. Now that I've got a couple years of playing under my belt, I'm considering taking a few songs out to the public.

I'm wondering what others have to say about the challenge of playing your songs out live. Any comments, hints, suggestions or warnings?

Thanks,
J

edit to add: Also, what do you think about "scripted" banter? I know that most banter isn't technically "scripted", but artists repeat the same banter between songs as a result of trying different things over and over and finding what works. Seems to me that keeping the audience involved and interested is vital. Comments?

If We Keep On At This Pace...

...all active participants could easily have at least one albums' worth of material to sift through by year's end.

In fact, if you wrote two songs a month, you would have 24 songs to choose from! But even if you only averaged one song a month you would still have 12 songs (more than enough for a traditional 10 song album).

Just a thought.


I guess this presumes that anyone cares about the album format anymore.
Discuss amongst yourselves: Is the album dead?
Even if it IS dead, it can't hurt to get the songs out of your head and into the world.

Plus, you're working through three or four ok songs to get to that really good one.

Songs and Absenteeism

THE ENVELOPE SONG.mp3 [01.25.07]

Hey guys. It's me, your token lady... back from her truancy.

So maybe this month was a horrible time to plan on writing four songs. Oh well. Besides getting hideously sick and having a hellish week singing with the Indianapolis Symphony (the music was pretty, it was just the 25+ hours devoted in one week on top of working full time that killed me), things have been kinda rough with my family. My dad got diagnosed with diabetes this week, so I wasn't in the mood to write pretty little love songs. Maybe I'll write a song about my mortality, just in time for Valentines' Day.

So anyway, I sent my two songs to John tonight, hopefully they'll make it up here soon. One is the "Lay the Line," for which I posted lyrics below.

Also tonight I recovered from my flimsy memory a song that I thought was lost... what a great relief that was. Inadvertently I already did one of John's little exercises from below- it's pretty much all verse. There is a bridge, but it doesn't go anywhere, just back to the verse, so maybe it's more like an oasis.

Regardless of the road to get there, here are the lyrics for "The Envelope Song." Yes, I wrote it on the back of an envelope. The BGVs are a little canned sounding, but with my limited recording capabilities at the moment (I'll post a separate blog on this later) it's about as good as I can get. You can either use your imagination to flesh things out a little, or pretend it's the Carpenters. I'd be flattered, either way.

The Envelope Song
words and music by Liza Swart

She walks by the water
She walks alone
She walks like her father
So far away from home
So far away --- from home

He loves like a brother
He loves with his soul
He loves no other
The one who makes him whole
The one who makes --- him whole

Here we stand
Heart in hand
On golden stands
You understand
You always understand

Well love is our mother
Love is a seed
Love is a wonder
And yes, love makes us free
And yes, love makes --- us free

yeah kinda sappy but what can I say. So am I. ;)

THE ENVELOPE SONG.mp3 [01.25.07]

That Water Came

That Water Came
words and music by John Natiw

Around the first of the year, I had been doing some bike rides through a local parkway here that had been flooded. The good news was that the parkway was closed, so I could ride on the roads. The parkway is designed to contain floodwaters and closes frequently during heavy rains. I'm always amazed at the power of water, and these four or five rides didn't change that. After pondering this for a few days, I figured there must be a song in there. I didn't want it to be a Katrina song, or about ANY particular flood for that matter. But it is a serious song.

The date of this recording is January 3rd and it was probably the second or third take I recorded. I listened back to it this morning after not hearing it for a few weeks and although this is an extremely early and rough representation of the song, was pleasantly surprised. I was intending on re-recording this one at a later date (and still will), but I thought it was worthy of posting.

This one has a bit of a "bluegrassy, sittin' on the front porch, thinkin' about stuff, story telling" feeling. There may eventually be a bridge added, but we'll see.

THAT WATER CAME.mp3 [01.25.07]

Mary had a baby last Sunday
She was just seventeen
Brought her home just three days later
times were lean

Friday night she sang to that baby
wind started to blow
storm was comin' along the old highway
the sky started to glow

that water came
like it knew her name

Mary dropped to her knees and said dear God
I'll do anything
If you spare me and my baby
I'll never ask again

I know there's been some things that I've done wrong
some that I regret
But if you could just help us to hold on
I'd be in your debt

but that water came
like it knew her name

that damn water came
(it came) just the same

they say the risin' water can't hear you
when it comes to call
no emotion or human feelings
it just takes it all

there wasn't anything anyone could do
in the rise and fall
two little angels died in that bayou
when the devil called

that water came
like it knew her name

that damn water came
(it came) just the same

black water came...

THAT WATER CAME.mp3 [01.25.07]

Things

The blog made me do it.

THINGS.mp3 [01.24.07]

(Original art by my brother...I thought it sort of fit the mood/idea for this song).

Seriously, this blog has been the best thing for my songwriting since my college days relationship angst songs...that and not watching the t.v. or using the computer as much.

:)

Things
words and music by Steven Wesley Guiles

VERSE 1
Take all my things, all that junk, the television
My radio, my books and my magazines

I try too hard, to hold on to the things that I don't
Really need, cause then I need something new to fill the hole

PRE-CHORUS
Brothers, Sisters, my heart blisters with the heat of the sun

CHORUS
Things I have that I can't keep
Pretty lights beyond my reach
Things I have that I can't see
Holding me here in my sleep
Things I try and let them go
but things are all I know

VERSE2
yeah I know, I know that I, can't take it with me
Sometimes that's all I need, some knowledge that'll set me free

I try too hard, to hold on to the things that I don't
Really need, cause then I need something new to fill the hole

PRE-CHORUS

BRIDGE
the only wa-ay, this goin' to stop
the only wa-ay is to get rid of those

CHORUS
Things I have that I can't keep
Pretty lights beyond my reach
Things I have that I can't see
Holding me here in my sleep
Things I try and let them go
but things are all I know

THINGS.mp3 [01.24.07]

Ponderings on Pitch

Ok, so I've been busy. Just not busy writing (at the moment). The past few days I've entered into a sort of "Master Class" on pitch. With the struggles I had singing All We Need Is Some Love, I decided to study the pitch ranges of some popular singers and compare the results with my own.

First, I had to understand pitch notation. Understanding that each octave begins with C, we then can label each octave's notes. Middle C, for instance, becomes C4. The A above middle C would be A4. The C lower than middle C would be C3, and so on.

Once I grasped this concept (which I had learned as a child during piano lessons, but needed a serious review of), I was able to begin studying popular songs (as well as my own).

I started with songs done by male vocalists that I was able to sing fairly well, without struggling. I would literally play the melody notes on my keyboard and keep track of the highest and lowest pitches sung. I did the same thing with a few other popular songs and finished up with a few songs of my own.

One of the things that jumped out at me was the range of notes a singer would include in a song. Ben Harper sings a range of only five notes in Waiting For You. Coldplay, on the other hand, includes two full octaves in Fix You, with a reach for C5 on a couple of occasions. Another song, Long December by Counting Crows covers six notes (F3-D4) but, amazingly, spends 95% of its time in THREE notes (F3-A3).

The main thing I learned is that most of these artists spend 90% of their singing time within a few notes of middle C. EVERY SONG (with the exception of Morning Yearning) covers the four notes G3-C4. The highest (and lowest) notes you see plotted here are generally sung one or two times in the entire song. Let It Be, for example, spends almost ALL of its time at or below A4. Only two or three times does Paul reach for the C5.

Another interesting observation is that there are great popular songs that are sung entirely below C4 (middle C). Morning Yearning (Ben Harper) and Empty (Ray Lamontagne) are a couple of examples. A song like 100 Years by Five for Fighting, however, spends most of its time ABOVE C4. Also, thinking about those who are gifted at hitting the high notes, during the famous chorus for When A Man Love a Woman, Percy Sledge bangs away mercilessly at the B4.

Finally, it's really interesting to me that my songs This Time and All We Need Is Some Love have the same highest pitch. What is interesting about this is that I don't have any trouble singing This Time, but struggle a bit with AWNISL. The reason, I think, is the way I sing the highest notes.

In This Time, I'm only up at E4 a few times and not for long. During AWNISL, I'm up there in the chorus and I hold out the E4 a bunch of times! It's really the signature note of the song. It may be some time before I write another song that requires me to be up around E4 for any length of time. One of my songs that is the most comfortable to sing is Stop the Rain. Interestingly, and perhaps obviously, it never ventures above C4 (middle C).

I encourage any artist to investigate and consider pitch. Learn where your strengths are. Learn your weaknesses. Study your favorite artists and the songs they sing! Use the information to YOUR benefit in writing your next great song!

Class dismissed,
J

Time Is Tickin': Let's Be Creative!

So, we've got ten days left in our first month.
How's everybody doing?


I thought we should at least have a weekly "post in" or "comment in" or "posted therapy session regarding songwriting".

Liza, how's that new song coming? John, did you have another one on the burner?

I also have an idea, why don't we post a few "do-able" song excercises or challenges with a specific theme/idea/subject so that we're not just working from the completely blank page.

Here are some ideas from the top of the head:

-write a commercial jingle
-write a kid's song about something silly
-take a famous poem (or any poem) and put it to music
-write a song using only two chords
-write a song consisting only of verses
-write a song about an inanimate object
-write a song from a character's point of view (not your own)
-write a song based on a book you've read
-write a song based on a movie you've watched

Every song doesn't have to change the world.
Every song doesn't have to be intelligent or witty.
Every song doesn't have to be your best.
We just need to keep trying.

:)

If The Song Is Good Enough For U2 and Arcade Fire To Cover, It Must Be Half Good

What can we learn from a song covered by such respected artists?
I love this song too, it's Joy Division's "Love Will Tear Us Apart Again".
What a gloriously sad song.

"Love Will Tear Us Apart" by Joy Division (from the album "Substance")
======================================================================

transcribed by Gilles Velay (gvelay@free.fr)

Updates :
* 16 jan 2005, fixed low notes on main riff thanks to
Armando Ciccarelli
* 24 mar 2004, added low notes on main riff, fix provided by
Armando Ciccarelli


Notations :
e : 8th q : quarter


Intro
-----
Some may think it's the guitar but I'm pretty sure it's the bass that
plays those chords on the intro (8 times) :

e e e e e e e e
G-|-9-9-9-9-9-9-9-9-|
D-|-7-7-7-7-7-7-7-7-|
A-|-----------------|
E-|-----------------|


Main Riff
---------
q e q e e e q e q e q q e e e e e e
G-|-9---9-9---9-9-9-|-11----12-11----9--7-----|---------------7-|
D-|-0---0-0---0-0-0-|--0-----0--0----0--0-----|-9---9-9-9-9-9---|
A-|-----------------|-------------------------|-----------------|
E-|-----------------|-------------------------|-----------------|

e e e e e e e e
G-|-9-9-9-9-9-9-9-9-|
D-|-7-7-7-7-7-7-7-7-|
A-|-----------------|
E-|-----------------|


Break Riff (8 times)
--------------------
q e e e e e e
G-|-9---9-9-9-9-9-9-|
D-|-7---7-7-7-7-7-7-|
A-|-----------------|
E-|-----------------|

The song structure is very simple, which is perhaps why so many people like it. Now that I think about it, which really, really complicated songs (structurally) have become big hits? Just wondering...not that writing songs is about having a big hit. Ultimately as a musician/artist, our goal is to connect with others via the song. Obviously this particular song connected with a lot of people.

Here's a video of the song on youtube.
Click here.

And U2 and Arcade Fire's version is here.
Love Will Tear Us Apart Again
When routine bites hard, and ambitions are low
And resentment rides high, but emotions won't grow
And we're changing our ways, taking different roads
Then love, love will tear us apart again --

Why is the bedroom so cold? You've turned away on your side
Is my timing that flawed - our respect run so dry?
[or in the Peel and Bains Douches versions:
Is my timing that flawed - have our feelings run dry?]
Yet there's still this appeal that we've kept through our lives
Love, love will tear us apart again --

You cry out in your sleep - all my failings expose
There's a taste in my mouth, as desperation takes hold
Just that something so good just can't function no more
When love, love will tear us apart again --

Lay the Line

LAY THE LINE.mp3 [01.14.07]

Ok-- so I don't have the mp3 available yet because I haven't recorded it, but I will post that part of the business tomorrow.

[Yes she does, as of 01.25.07! Check it out! JN]

the good news is that I've finished a song. And now that I'm not sick, or singing 5 million performances a day with the symphony, I'll actually have time to catch up with you gentlemen! I've finished the bit that I posted earlier, and there is no "awful" in the lyrics. (Although it could be said about them...)

I don't know if this is a keeper yet. time will tell- but I like it now, and since it's now, I'm ok with it.

LAY THE LINE.mp3 [01.14.07]

Phone rings in the night
Woke me up, but that's alright
I'll take what I can get
Just to talk with you in bed
No games this time
If it's wrong or if it's right--

Take my heart tonight
I'll lay it on the line
Oh love, I'm all for you
I've seen it in your eyes
Farewell to this disguise
Trade in these lies for truth (lies for truth)

Fire in the sky
I was pressed against your side
Your eyes in the dark
Started fires in my heart
No more dancing, please
Let's just say what we mean

Take my heart tonight
I'll lay it on the line
Oh love, I'm all for you
I've seen it in your eyes
Farewell to this disguise
Trade in these lies for truth

Take my heart, take my heart... I'm all for you
Take my heart, take my heart....
Just take my heart tonight
I'll lay it on the line
Oh love, I'm all for you
I've seen it in your eyes
Farewell to this disguise
Trade in these lies for truth (lies for truth)

Phone rings in the night
Woke me up, but that's alright

LAY THE LINE.mp3 [01.14.07]

Chalk Up Another One For Science!

So, as you may know, I've been frustrated with trying to sing All We Need Is Some Love. Tonight, after tuning my guitar down ANOTHER half step, I sat down to figure out if it would be possible to play it in another key and, thereby, save my pipes (such as they are) and keep the tension on my guitar at a healthy level.

On the recording, I'm playing [C F Am G] on the verse on a guitar tuned down a half step which yields [Bb E G#m F#]... I think. This is still pretty high for me when we get to the chorus, which is [Dm Am G] or [C#m G#m F#m] in reality. After fumbling around with transposing it myself, I had the brilliant idea that there must be a better way!

Well, there is! And it's called Autotransposer.

Simply enter the chord progressions (C F Am G for example) for up to five fields (verse, chorus, bridge for example) and click transpose, and viola! Many new keys to try your creation in. For this one, I tried the progression [G C Em D] for the verses (now played on a standard tuned guitar) and [Am Em D] for the chorus.

What I've effectively done is transpose the song down four steps (assuming the original guitar tuned down a half step and the new one tuned regular). For instance, the chorus was, in reality [C#m G#m F#m] and now becomes [Am Em D]. Amazingly, I can actually sing it in this key.

I'm not sure how I'll record the next version, but I'm leaning toward this new key. Maybe I'll post this new version against the previous one and have you give it a listen.

Of course if I end up hiring Bono to sing it, I can play it back in its original key.

Carry on,
J

All We Need Is Some Love

ALL WE NEED IS SOME LOVE.mp3 [02.02.07] - completely re-recorded/updated w/harmonica break and raised in pitch.

ALL WE NEED IS SOME LOVE.mp3 [01.25.07] - w/drums!

ALL WE NEED IS SOME LOVE.mp3 [01.15.07]

VERSE
in the dark of the night
through the thickest fight
when you've got nothing to give

when the things that you hold
leave you shattered and cold
and you forget how to live

CHORUS
All you need is some love
A little help from above
When all hope is gone
All we need is some love

VERSE
when you sleep all alone
with a hand on the phone
wondering when it will ring

and you wish on that star
doesn't matter how far
'cause you'd give anything

CHORUS
What you need is some love
A little help from above
When you can't carry on
All we need is some love

BRIDGE [not sure about these lyrics at this point]
Never let the darkness in this world
Take away your spirit and your hope
Never stop believing in the day'
That violence and hatred won't be found

INSTRUMENTAL BREAK [as verse]

CHORUS
All you need is some love
A little help from above
When all hope is gone
All we need is some love

What you need is some love
What you need is some love
When all hope is gone
All we need is some love

All we need is some...
All we need is some...
All we need is some...
All we need is some Love

The Story of "All We Need Is Some Love"

This one has come about by simply playing a chord progression over and over the past few days. Oddly, for me, the chorus came first. I'd just sit here and hum some melodies over it and one seemed to be begging to be sung. Once I had the chord progression and melody somewhat nailed down, it seemed to me that the song was wanting to speak to this theme of love and hope. I've said many times that I don't really feel like I "write" songs, I just discover them. Peeling away the covering until it shines through. It pays to learn how to listen for the song, I suppose.

Once I had a basic chorus idea, I set to work on the verses. These came much slower (probably because I don't usually write them after the chorus). I made a conscious effort to keep the melody for the verses a bit lower and quieter (dynamically). Once I had hummed enough melodies and chosen one, I put the "meat on the bones" and wrote a couple of simple verse lyrics. All the while, trying to speak to this universal theme of love and hope.

This is very "naked" and bare. All my vocal and creative weaknesses are there for your perusal. In this take (one of the first), I was more concerned with the phrasing of the lyrics in relation to the music than how I was singing (obviously). I have a long way to go before I know how to perform this song. Being able to play it once and perform it are two different things, I think.

In the end, I can hear lots of soaring background vocals and organ as the song swells to it's climax, which I hear happening right in the middle of the last (longer) chorus.

But for now, here is a *very* rough/bare/naked draft of...

ALL WE NEED IS SOME LOVE.mp3 [02.02.07] - completely re-recorded/updated w/harmonica break and raised in pitch.

ALL WE NEED IS SOME LOVE.mp3 [01.25.07] - w/drums!

ALL WE NEED IS SOME LOVE.mp3 [01.15.07]

Thanks for listening,
John

Some Junk

So I worked a little bit tonight, and hells bells if I can't get out of writing in the same key right now... it just happens though and I know enough to go with it when it comes. that's what capos are for, right? ;)

But it's coming along, coming along. The chorus bit that I have so far lyrically goes-

So take my heart tonight
I'll lay it on the line
Oh love, I'm all for you (or, alternately, can be "awful... you" with the you tagging to the next portion of the chorus- maybe I'll never tell anyone what I'm singing so you'll have to guess- call me Karin jr.)
I've seen it in your eyes
Farewell to this disguise
Trade in these lies for truth

hmmm and oh yes I'm thinking verses something about a bobbypin in a shoe metaphor? the words are still wishy washy so I'm reluctant to be any more forthcoming at this point. but you've all been so lovely about being in my corner I felt I had to throw my brain junk up here for now. I'll finish this one tomorrow after it has properly gestated and basted in my brain.

Goodnight.

Mark My Words, I Can't Please You

I CAN'T PLEASE YOU.mp3 [01.10.07a] (inception--a ghost was born)

I CAN'T PLEASE YOU.mp3 - [01.10.07b] (the "let's see how if THIS background vocal works and oooohhh I found the reverb button in ProTools!" mix)

I am walking out into the studio now. On the way to work this morning I got a song idea, only a chorus, but it's snappy, and I probably stole it from some poppy 60s song, but I'm going to whip it out and post it anyways.

This song may very well fall under the "slogging-through-the-garbage-to-find-the-buried-treasure" category.

Be back in a bit...

[first post was at 9:45ish on Tuesday night, song was "completed" around 11pm and the following information was added]

I did it! Yippeeeee! It's a ditty of a song. Chorus - Verse - Chorus - Verse - Chorus.

I've included two versions of the song: the one I sang into the computer at work this morning to save the original idea (I had to keep singing it to myself on my way to my room from my car), and the "studio version" using a better mic and having a more completed idea. The original idea was only the chorus part.

Here they are:

I CAN'T PLEASE YOU.mp3 [01.10.07a] (inception--a ghost was born)

I CAN'T PLEASE YOU.mp3 - [01.10.07b] (the "let's see how if THIS background vocal works and oooohhh I found the reverb button in ProTools!" mix)

I CAN'T PLEASE YOU

CHORUS
I can't please you
Nothing I do (will make you smile)
I can't get through to you

VERSE
When I try to make you happy (make you happy)
Something stops you and you won't let me (you won't let me)
I won't lie...

CHORUS

VERSE

CHORUS


I CAN'T PLEASE YOU.mp3 [01.10.07a] (inception--a ghost was born)

I CAN'T PLEASE YOU.mp3 - [01.10.07b] (the "let's see how if THIS background vocal works and oooohhh I found the reverb button in ProTools!" mix)

liza, schmiza

so, I've already failed-- and it's the first week!

I was ridiculously sick this last week... imagine screws connecting your temples to your jaw and tightening almost imperceptibly, continually, forever. it was something like that.

I still wanna do 4 songs this month- can I make up for it later? many apologies.

(still) your favorite loser...
liza

This Guy Listens To Crappy Music

David Byrne.


A crappy music listener.

This article is deep and wide and looks into the implications/ramifications of music formats (tape/lp/cd/mp3) on it's creation.

Here it is.

Quiet, Successful Careers

I just read the following in an interview with Glen Phillips in this month's Acoustic Guitar magazine:

Phillips decision to release Mr. Lemons on his own label came after several years of making demos and shopping them to major labels. "When getting signed becomes your job, you're no longer a musician," he says. "My job needs to be making music. That makes me happier than just about anything." Lauding relatively under-the-radar bands like Over the Rhine and the Decemberists for taking production into their own hands and not waiting around for the business to recognize them, Phillips says a rewarding life in music doesn't have to be based on "big hype and lots of dollars. It's about having quiet, successful careers."

Indeed.
J

Time To Kill (working title)

Here's my latest offering for the Songwriting Apples perusal.
It's a combination of two songs (and one instrumental piece from an older song) that all seemed to blend together pretty well).

TIME TO KILL.mp3 - [01.03.07]
Lyrics and Chords

The "outro" of the song is just me babbling a melody because I'm not sure what to put there yet (I'm even open to what you hear there). I like the melody and I think it's a good hook at the end that give the listener something entirely new on the way out. I've always liked how Dave Grohl of The Foo Fighters would throw in these amazingly cool riffs/lines/melodies in the very end of the song. This is no where near as cool or as rockin' as that, but it DOES introduce a new idea melodically, which is what I was going for.

There's a transition from the bridge to the final chorus that feels a little awkward and I'm not sure what to do with it, so again I'm open to ideas here as well.